First, you need to assess if you really need this renewal or not.
E.g. if you are not restricted from travel by Schengen, then you probably can use one of your ‘native’ non-PT passports that’s visa-free for Europe and disregard your expired GV. You will then apply for PT citizenship upon reaching the 5-year anniversary of your first GV card.
However, if you ARE restricted by Schengen, then the only way to obtain the renewal (or indeed anything else from AIMA) is via lawsuit. Find a lawyer who would help with this.
How can you apply for citizenship with an expired card? If I understand correctly, at the moment you submit the citizenship application your card must be valid. Even if you travel around Europe with schengen accessed passport (i.e. American passport), need to be careful because polices might do some serious counts and if you exceed 90 days in schengen zone, it is not a good thing.
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My lawyer told me that without a valid card, citizenship application will not process.
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I would be cautious about accepting the word of lawyers in Portugal.
In my personal experience, I have contacted multiple lawyers about the same issue and got completely different answers.
With hundreds of thousands of desperate residency applicants, the lawyers can say anything. Perhaps even things that will increase their fees and billable hours. Millions to be made here by “professionals” with no need to become a people smuggler… Happy Days.
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It is not possible to get a citizenship without valid card. On the stage 3 IRN will do a request to AIMA regarding your 5 year period. At the moment, if you do not have a valid card, AIMA replies “does not meet the requirements”.
“… in Portugal…”
Seriously? 6 lawyers can give you 12 different opinions in ANY country.
And what’s with the slamming of Portugal on this thread? You chose to come here. If you don’t like it, leave. Otherwise recognize that every society has bonuses and challenges then work constructively to resolve the challenges and celebrate the bonuses.
-Rob
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In my opinion, requirement of 5 years is different from having a valid card. As you said, at step 3, a request will be sent to AIMA to check for 5 years. I agree with that.
Regarding the check of a valid card, i think they check it at step 0. Without the valid card, you cannot even submit the application…But I might be wrong…
If there isn’t a condition of having valid card, then all immigrants can stop renew their residency when they overcome 5 years.
Wow Rob. So defensive? I did not suggest that lawyers here are different to any other country. Are you a lawyer perhaps?
The point was that a lawyers opinion isn’t the final word on anything anywhere. So I do appreciate someone sharing the lawyers opinion but just wanted to put it into context.
On a related note, to address the “fit in or f-off” mentality, is the suggestion that with 400,000+ residency applications applications pending, nobody is allowed to complain or request remedies? Especially after making significant personal and financial sacrifices?
Sounds very similar to fascist dictatorships of old. No room for pointing out problems. Anyway, hope the situation has a good outcome for all that are affected.
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“If you dont like it, leave” is a terrible attitude. Anywhere can be made better, everywhere has problems worth criticizing…
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Thanks for your response, very helpful.
C’mon, you can disagree with their sentiment without resorting to that kind of rhetoric. “If you don’t like it, leave” is the stuff of anti-immigrant populists. Citizens complain about lawyers, government, and bureaucracy. Immigrants are also entitled to complain. This is a forum to help people navigate visa renewal systems, which are in a notoriously poor state right now. I’ll be happy to ‘celebrate the bonuses’ with my family when there is something to celebrate.
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It is not about what you or I think. It is a current practice. First, nothing is checked on the stage 0. Second, IRN bases its analysis on some replies from “external organs” additionally to documents. At the moment, when AIMA is requested for the time count, and if there is no valid card, AIMA replies that conditions are not met. It is how AIMA treat the law and time count. As the law says “IS a resident for at least 5 yrs”, not “WAS”.
It could change if AIMA changes its reading of the law, but at the moment you need to have a valid residence card at the stage 3. And no, covid prolongation does not work in that case.
I don’t care if y’all argue with each other but please do it in another thread. I come here for updates on renewals.
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But does it mean that one can apply for citizenship some months (years?) before hitting the 5y residency mark AND without a valid card as none of that is checked at stage 0? What’s the approx. time lag between stage 0 and 3?
I would say that it is really better to wait at the moment. Changing the lawyer will not help. It is not possible to renew GV residence since new year. So expiration in July is relatively good in comparison. Gives some time.
I was afraid that it would be like that just after the law Mais Habitação became in force. But we, people with cards expiring in 4q 23, were lucky, as we got autorenewal despite the law was published. But since then - nothing.
No autorenewal, no IRN and no scheduling in AIMA. Just nothing.
Obviously IRN could subtract time to check if the requirement of 5 yrs was fulfilled at the time of application. Do you think it is difficult? No such cheating will work.
I was just saying that nothing is checked at the stage 0, only on stage 4. But it does not mean that requirements are checked vs only time of analysis.
And no, I do not contradict myself. AIMA will give negative reply if there is no valid residence at the time of its reply. You could consider not renewing yr card only on the stage 4, but it is also risky as there are cases when processes returned to stage 3 from later stages.
The time was about 1.5-2 yrs with paper application. Could be faster with online, but there is no consistency yet to say.
Why I said " it is what I think"? Because I only read it through forum and I have not experienced it myself. Have you applied the citizenship by person (not online via lawyer)? Under my research from several forum, if someone applies in person (not online):
- The application is checked before they accept the application. The first thing they check is the valid resident card. If the card is expired, application cannot be submitted. That’s why I call Step 0. You cannot even submit the application physically. Therefore Step 0 exists if you apply in person.
- Resident of at least 5 years is checked at Step 3: I agree with that.
- Covid prolongation does not work in that case: Not sure what you meant. Some people still get the “contagem do tempo” that includes theirs waiting times during Covid. Let’s talk by example: One has 1st card from 01/2019-01/2021 and he was unable to renew it until 10/2023 due to Covid. His 2nd card is valid from 11/2023-11/2025. In 01/2024 he reached his 5 years of resident and he went to Aima to get the “contagem do tempo”. After 2 months, he got the “contagem do tempo” in 03/2024. And he applied for citizenship in 04/2024. All conditions are met: valid resident card; contagem do tempo 5 years, and A2 portuguese.
Have you tried to include the covid times into your “contagem do tempo”?
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Applying in person is rear, most applied by mail (paper in envelope) before online application were available.
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Have you seen Contagem de tempo? It contains the last card. Number and validity. You will not get contagem de tempo without valid card. You could submit contagem de tempo at the beginning (it is better to do it), but this document is not obligatory.
Time periods without card between valid cards during covid counts as valid residence period. But expired card does not count as “valid” for citizenship, even if it during covid prolongation. It is what I have meant. -
If you submitted contagem de tempo but time passes and at the stage 3 your card expired, IRN will send the new request to AIMA. Moreover, if at stage 3 your card mentioned in first contagem de tempo expires soon it seems that IRN wait till expiration before send a request to AIMA
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There are cases that people with expired cards get requests for additional docs and even preliminary negative decision on citizenship during covid. Nobody cared that it was almost not possibly to get the slot to renew GV card. They wanted valid card. Period. However, covid helped to receive extention of the time period for new doc. The processes have not resumed until new cards were received.
P.S. As usual everything may change. I describe the current practice.
I would love to answer your points:
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Applying in person is NOT rare at all. It is actually common for the native portuguese speaking immigrants. They want to save money and they usually do it themselves. They often prefer applying in person than applying by mail. No one wants to take risk losing important documents by the post office. Moreover, as said, when applying in person, the officer checks all documents OK or not, then the receipt of submission is given. It feels much better and safer. Only the non-portuguese speakers need to use lawyers because of the language barriers.
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Of course I saw the contagem do tempo. I upload the photo here for everyone as well. There are lots of clips on youtube by brazilien giving instrution of how to get this document. I did not mention that an invalid card could give you a contagem do tempo. Again, when applying for contagem do tempo at Aima/sef, the officer check the validity of the card. If the card is invalid, you cannot even submit the request to get contagem do tempo. So I could call it Step -1 (minus 1).
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For entire process of citizenship, card should be valid. If it expires during the process, one must try all possible ways (including filing lawsuits) to get it renewal. In practice they check the validity of card at step 3, who guarantees that they will not look at it again at step 5 6…?
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The percentage of obtaining citizenship is very high. Almost 99%. I cannot find the article. Process is very clumsy. My recommendation is to launch nuclear weapons (lawsuits) at all and every steps. Cost more but push things moving.
I guess that’s why it’s good to switch to (GV) PR as soon as possible since that card is 5 years, vs just renewing GV which is 2 years.
Of course with the new law, many people may be eligible to apply for citizenship long before they are eligible to apply for PR which is strange!