Not to go into too much detail, but things like documents from countries they are not nor have ever been citizens of, but that the relevent agency is convinced they are and wont accept evidence to the contrary. Not to say this happens to most or even many people, but imagine getting to the end and finding another agency that blocks you for years or even indefinitely over something like that.
Which is to say, if you want to live in Portugal, a D7 and maybe at the end of it permanent residency even if citizenship doesnāt come through is a very sensible path. It is a great country! But the GV as a path to citizenship doesnāt seem to make sense to me given the other alternative programs, the clear disregard SEF and others have for the GV applicants, the massively extended timelines, and general uncertainty.
Hi! Like you Iāve had experience dealing with foreign bureacracies (mainly in slow processes in Europe and cajoling/bribery in Northern Africa), so was expecting it to not go as advertised. I understand delays and maybe a lawyer being told some documents are insufficient one day by one employee, but miraculously sufficient the next day by another. Our local building department certainly works this way sometimes, lol. But a total inability to submit applications, and Iāve heard renewals, for six plus months is just on another level to me. Based on the Idealista articles by which my advisor ādiscoveredā this issue, it sounded like SEF and the government have major systemic problems, some due to reorganization but also possibly related to animosity towards the program and was not accepting applications for political reasons, which could easily arise again. And in that situation, according to the lawyers quoted, investors are really without recourse.
I would go the 280K real estate route with supposed buyback as the fund route is not realistic for my situation. I am OK with the money just sitting there, but I am not OK with the money just sitting there if the GV cannot submitted or approved, and just trying to figure out the risk.
I am interested in the GV vs D7 because I also do not want to move there for several years or ever. I view it as a get out of dodge card in the event of major political instability here and to provide more opportunities for my children.
Oddly, the poor performance of the US stock market is some consolation for paying an advisory fee on false or misleading statements. Iām just losing money all around, so whatās a bit more, lol!!
Beyond me being livid and embarrassed that I was conned into these advisory fees I am thinking the same thing. I was not expecting it to be as seamless as advertised, but I was expecting that it worked and a six month period of not accepting application without reason is not my definition of working. The advisor supposedly discovered this problem through an Idealistia article that painted a very unflattering portrait of SEF and the government (though I am sure he already knew of this). Had I known I certainly never would have even paid an advisory fee.
Maybe itās just me, but if I had this type of business, my sales pitch would have been something like, āhey, itās a good program, but FYI, the government has it on hold. Let me get back to you once itās going again.ā Scam artist abound these days!
I might just continue in the process, without investing just to make these %*!@'s work some more.
I can imagine the frustration of being asked for additional documents, but i would imagine they would request a āNo Criminal Recordā certificate from countries they have been resident in.
Itās always better to be as specific as possible in this Forum in order not to discourage people or keep them on edge.
Naturalization is an end goal for most applicants, and itās very concerning if statements provided are taken as facts.
I am no expert in Naturalization law, and Iām not doubting there may be requests that are difficult to complete, but please be specific and detailed in order to let the members understand and make an informed direction thselves.
Understood the concern, but the problem is not mine (Iām regretfully at the beginning of the process) and I donāt want to share identifying details. It was not criminal records, which is an overcomable problem, but again literally impossible to produce documents the request of which their lawyers have not, as of now, been able to dropped. Theyāve been trying for a long time. Maybe it will eventually resolve favorably for them and maybe that type of problem is rare, I canāt say. But itās enough to remind me that naturalization is not guaranteed at the end of the 5 years, and certainly not on any timeline.
I didnāt even mention my experiences in Africa and the Middle East, because theyāre so much worse than this! I am not so sure SEF has animosity toward the GV program - I think Americans (of which I am one) have a tendency to think there must be āAā reason for everything when, in fact, there often are multiple factors at play.
This isnāt for the faint at heart, but I donāt think weāre on the highway to hell. Itās just the way things roll in some places - and apparently this is one of those places.
Iām also keen to know whether biometric appointment bookings are also now open?
We received pre-approval in March '22 (main applicant) and May '22 (family members), approximately five and six months after applications were submitted in October '21 (main applicant) and November '21 (family members).
No word as yet from lawyer regarding appointments for biometrics.
Does anyone know if they are still offering appointments according to the new chronological system that had been in place?
Although I had been prepared at the outset to be patient with the process - being just very grateful that there was this amazing opportunity to gain/regain EU citizenship in the first place (āremoanerā here!) - I am increasingly irritated with the situation.
I chose the GV route not only because the D7 was not suitable for us - weāre not in a position right now to spend 6 months per year in Portugal (though we might be in the future) - but also to obtain EU citizenship for our adult dependent children who are in FT education. At the rate things are going however they will ātime outā, i.e. complete their studies and be wanting to get jobs before completing five years of residency.
At the time we embarked on the process I estimated about 6 months from submission of applications to receiving residency permits. They might have squeaked through under that time scale. But with biometric appointments frozen until who knows when and this backlog I now keep hearing about, perhaps itās another 18 months to 2 years before we even begin the 5 year residency period, by which time our kids will have virtually finished their studies. Had I known this it would certainly have changed the calculus and Iām not sure I would have bothered.
I really hope SEF might seriously consider something like back-dating residency - once it is granted - to the date we were pre-approved - (as a goodwill gesture for all this humbug?). As regards visits to Portugal, the requirement is 1 week per year. They could just say 5 weeks in 5 years and leave us to sort it out. They could also let us do biometrics at the nearest Portuguese consulate in the country weāre actually living in, saving the hassle and anxiety of suddenly having to book travel, accommodation in Portugal to fit within some random time frame that appears out of the blue. However I can probably just keep dreaming. But I do wonder if anyone from SEF reads these forums?!
The only saving graces are -
a) my husband and I are in no particular hurry ourselves - it can take 10 years from our point of view. Itās just the ākidsā;
b) the IMGA AƧÅes Portugal fund we chose is the only one of our investments that is currently āupā. Everything else has tanked as of the time of writing!
Yeah, it seemed like the SEF closure was a combo of re-organizing, budgets and lack of will/animosity towards the program. One article I read quoted a lawyer saying something along the lines of āthis is not happening because someone does not want it to.ā I suppose I would feel better about the whole thing if the firm I hired, as well as Mercan, La Vida, and Get Golden Visa had been upfront about the SEF closure. Maybe I did not phrase my questions specifically enough to get it out of them, but you canāt know what you donāt know.
Just wondering about the logic on why D7 applicants can get thier biometrics done at thier local consulates however GV applicants cant do the same.
It just make no sense
I hear (so this is hearsay,) that they will pick back up in Q3 (which starts next month). Crossed fingers we can get ours shortly thereafter, as weāve had pre-approval since August 31, 2021.
The other minor difference is that D7s get an appointment with SEF for their biometrics when they get the D7 approval. GV applicants wait years with no clarity into their situation.
Wow, it looks like everybody missed that this is even happening in the parliament. How did none of know about this? With so many discussions in this thread no one had mentioned these bills
Thank you for sharing. This confirms at least some points that my lawyer conveyed to me recently. Hopefully she is also correct on other issues such as ādevelopment of special task force within SEF to cope with the backlogā.
