That was quick! Can you share a link to this information/announcement?
Congratulations everyone, hope it will help all of us
10 Likes
Woo! That is great news.
Now, onto the next unknown!
3 Likes
So now we wait to see if AIMA clarifies whether the start of the 5 year clock is initial application or biometrics. In the unlikely case, it is biometrics, we should still be filing lawsuits. If itâs initial application, then those of us not living in Portugal and not needing residency cards yet, should not file any lawsuit, in order to save ourselves money?
1 Like
I imagine that one real test will come when somebody like @tsiksssooo
(waiting for 4 years and 2 months before receiving his wifeâs card- his own card has still not been received) asks AIMA in 10 months for a âCertidĂŁo de contagem de tempo â as proof that he achieved 5 yearsâ residency as per the Nationality Law now approved.
It will be interesting to know what timeline AIMA apply (in 2020, the time from application submission to pre-approval was mostly 90 days), making the difference small. Should AIMA choose to ignore the waiting time of 4 years +( but choose the date of first card payment Nov 23) there would surely be grounds to contest.
7 Likes
Yes!!! FINALLY some good news for us all.
2 Likes
Can we really say which scenario is likely or unlikely? I havenât read anything concrete.
Superb. I canât think of many countries that would give this level of broad based relief these days.
cough USA cough
(Hopefully we are included to the fullest extent )
4 Likes
Very good news that this didnât get bounced back to a (currently dissolved!) Parliament, with uncertainty as to how a new balance of power might vote.
So now we wait for the regulatory interpretation⊠is this 90d after thereâs a new Parliament (post 10-March)? Or can the caretaker government proceed, not knowing who their next bosses and their objectives will be? Iâd wager theyâll sit on it for 3 weeks until the dust settles.
1 Like
Damn it Chris, how do you do it? You scooped it last time too. I was hitting reload every few hours on the Presidentâs website and missed it. Didnât expect the President would be working on the weekend but good for him 
3 Likes
So who now decides whether the legislators meant to backdate it to initial application or biometrics? AIMA?
1 Like
Unless the regulations stipulate its the initial application then I guess it will be the courts who have to decide when an applicant objects?
But remember Portugal has no concept of precedent. So if the courts decide one way in one case, that doesnât mean they wonât decide another way in another case.
To be realistic, this new citizenship law was initialised by the immigrants from Brazil Angola Mozambique. They often come to Portugal with tourist visas. The passport holders from Brazil do not need visa to enter the Schengen Zone. Then they submit something called âManifestação de interesseâ which shows their intention to stay in the country with their work contract signed when they visit the country as a tourist. With this kind of approach, they can change status from a short time visitor to a temporary resident. The whole process takes 2-2.5 years. It also takes them about 1.5-2 years to be scheduled by SEF for interview and biometric. Hence, they battled for their significant waiting times.
We are lucky that the brasilien immigrants are on the same side with us. The current written law does not differentiate what kind of residency can benefit. As the new updated citizenship law is currently written, I believe that it will count from the day of submitting application. Because if it counts from biometric, then the immigrants by âManifestação de interesseâ will not save a lot of waiting times (only 3-5 months max). Hence, I lean towards the date of submission.
17 Likes
It really depends when they consider our applications fully finalized and submitted. If they consider pre-biometrics applications more like Expressions of Interest until they receive biometrics and can actually process the application, that wouldnât be very helpful to us.
Fingers crossed that you are correct!
1 Like
This is not only for CPLP countries (Brazil etc). Basically anyone from any country who can legally enter Portugal on a Schengen tourist visa, can on the very next day, apply for NIF, social security, get accommodation, work contract (any work, not highly qualified activity or anything). They can then file an expression of interest, legally stay, work, pay taxes in Portugal. Biometrics appointment takes ~2 years of waiting, following which they get their first temporary residence permit. Same workflow as described by @live2learn.
This was accomplished by amendments to Article 88 and 89 of the Aliens Act in 2017 which waived the requirement for a residence visa or job seekerâs visa to file an expression of interest.
Plenty of South Asians have emigrated via this route. Iâve talked to 4-5 people in Lisbon and Faro who are driving Ubers , working at restaurants, owning restaurants. Theyâve all got the same story. Asked how they felt about SEF delays, none were particularly bothered - they like the fact that you can legal working immigrant status quickly with minimum fuss, and will eventually get European passports, intermediate delays donât signify. They like the country, the weather and cost of living (compared to the rest of EU), and were generally appreciative of government support. (Small sample, anecdotal value only)
I agree with @live2learn, the date considered is likely to be the expression of interest date. What that maps to for ARI is still unclear, but if the spirit of the legislation is honoured, it is likely to be the âanalysisâ date when the first fee was paid.
12 Likes
For what itâs worth, the legislative process began with a petition filed by Juliet Cristino, representing Brazilian nationals, which specifically requested that acceptance date of the manifestação de interesse be used as the start date.
9 Likes
Note that the acceptance date by SEF may not be the date of electronic filing. We filed on March 27, but the date of the âARI - Notificação de Aceitaçãoâ, was May 12th. That had the following statement: âInformamos que, em 12-05-202X, foi admitida a candidatura de Autorização de ResidĂȘncia de Investimento (ARI)â with my name.
My lawyer believes this will be the date used. Her reasoning there is that it is after SEF has confirmed that the packet is complete, and that they wouldnât want to allow someone to gain priority with a packet that was missing major documents. Because it is the signal that you can apply for the biometrics appointment, where most of the delays actually were, it still provides the relief intended by the parliament, but without creating an opportunity to game the system.
Whether this is how it plays out, I donât know. But that was her take on it.
2 Likes
Thereâs plenty of PTSD on this forum (I should say, present continuous stress disorder) by definition. Literally every single person here has suffered - some very grievously indeed - from uncertainty and delays.
Nevertheless, I will stick my neck out and suggest that the long arc of Portuguese immigration policy bends towards increasing liberality.
If we consider the changes in immigration law and regulations in the last 6 years:
- First residence card went from 1 year to 2 years.
- Naturalisation period went down from 6 years to 5.
- The naturalisation period went from continuous to interpolated 5 years within the last 15 years.
- Subjectivity around âeffective connection to national communityâ for naturalisation went away.
- Alternate exam-free path to language proficiency proof opened up.
- Automatic renewals for ARI (temporarily) opened up with zero documentation.
- New regulations point to more automation, less documentation, less biometrics.
- Naturalisation law amended to consider earlier start date (details awaited)
All the changes above benefit ARI applicants. In the regular non-ARI paths, Aliens Act was tweaked to let people come in on a tourist visa, get a work contract, file an expression of interest, and live and work legally. No per-country quotas, no work visa lottery, no high skill, qualification bar. This is some serious Ellis Island shit. âGive us your tired, your huddled masses yearning for bacalhauâ. I donât know of any other tier-1 passport country where you can do this.
Of course the best policies in the world are useless without good implementation, and Portugalâs implementation track record has been terrible. There are policy setbacks too - the GV clauses in Mais Habitacaoâs original draft were shocking because they bucked this trend, and threatened retrospective harm. But the same parliament which passed Mais Habitacao, passed an amendment to the nationality law (in its lame duck phase, too), which shortens the naturalisation timeline for most immigrants. No simplistic model of Portugal will account for both.
21 Likes
Portugal is in a fantastic position for the future with their immigration policy once they clean it up and make AIMA efficient.
They just need to not fumble it by keeping it hard to build things (fixes housing) and lower taxes (since rates are punitive, to say the least), and maybe some general business deregulation.
Iâm optimistic for Portugal if they can manage that, theyâve got 1/3 done and itâs a hard one, as you say no other major country has immigration policy like that. Closest I can think of is Argentina which isnât exactly an EU member
Frankly as an American itâs embarrassing that Portugal is making us look so bad, immigration is supposed to be our thing.
The other problem is the right wing xenophobic backlash, which may bring Chega into power next month. Fingers crossed we avoid that. More concerning is the populaceâs opinion that would lead them to vote for Chega, Iâm not sure how to change that.