You may be right. I am not here to talk you out of anything. But if you think about your comment it makes no sense or maybe your lawyer does not understand. SEF has nothing to do with citizenship as it is handled by another agency. So what SEF thinks about this situation seems not relevant. Maybe your lawyer means that SEF would not renew your residence visa? I don’t know what the basis for that would be, but I guess anything is possible.
Yes, exactly, I’m talking about SEF as it is the organisation responsible for investment residence visas. No 5 years visa’s story - no citizenship story.
Dear all I checked this with my lawyers as I am likely to face this situation in the mid-future…
Here is what I heard
My lawyers told me that from Portugal’s perspective there is no prohibitve law and they confirmed that they have a client who holds residence from another Schengen country.
Still they advised me to check with the other Schengen country for confirmation, yet they are unaware of any pan European legistlation blocking someone from getting 2 residence permits. Individual countries might have different practices or interpretation of the same law?
All the best
Yes, you are absolutely right. Faced with such a possible problem, we realized that the easiest option is not to focus on working in the EU for the next 6 years (after 5 years have passed since the opening of the first portuguese visa, waiting for citizenship, you can already work in the EU, as the lawyer explained to us). This will have to be kept in mind if we want to try to reach Portuguese citizenship.
Maybe different countries may have different visa requirements. But the most interesting thing is that different visa centers in one country can interpret the current legislation in different ways. For example, I asked a lawyer about a story with a student with a Portuguese golden visa who was denied an Austrian study visa (see above), does this mean that a priori there will be problems in Austria in a similar case? she said, no, there is no link to the country, there is a link to a specific visa center and its specialists
This is all definitely frustrating and disappointing. It does seem to me that there is no law prohibiting it, though I can see plenty of cases where it may simply be logistically impossible to meet the requirements of both in some cases.
I guess we all know all is always at the whim of a SEF officer. That there is variation from office to office, I guess does not surprise me that much. I would not expect this much variability around this topic, though, when there is no clear law against that I can see.
It probably depends on the lawyer you use. I think some are simply better at getting what they want out of SEF than others - better relationships with officers, or more willing to yell, or having the right phone numbers. One lawyer is an ex government minister (this is public information so I’m not disclosing anything) - you can’t tell me she doesn’t have a few phone numbers in her rolodex. My lawyer is willing to go out there and dig and scrap and fight and escalate for clients. But certainly other lawyers will be just doing plug-n-chug stuff, uncomfortable being so aggressive, unconnected, or simply going to look at a negative consequence and say “oh well, sorry”. I want to say that this is just Portugal, but I quite imagine it’s true anywhere; perhaps more so in some places than others but nonetheless.
I agree that if it goes to an actual official dispute, the cost and pain would suck. But I imagine there are things that can happen well before then.
Then again I can certainly see where one would not even want to take the risk, for if it goes wrong then you’ve lost the Portuguese residency you’ve spent all this time and effort and money to get in the first place. I don’t know what I’d do personally.
I’ve asked the exact same question to my lawyer and got the exact same answer. My case is NL permanent residence and PT GV (mandatory presence for a few weeks a year). There are no laws in both countries that prevent having both. The above-mentioned opinion (I suppose he didn’t quote or presented hard proofs) of the Mercan lawyer doesn’t seem credible and making any sense.
I completely agree with Username1.1
Olga, I am in the exact same position as you are. I am considering the Portugal GV but I am also in discussion with my company about moving to another Schengen Zone country. My main goal is to be able to live and work freely in the Schengen Zone, now and long term. Mercan told me the exact same thing they told you, I cannot pursue the GV and move to a separate Schengen Zone country while I go through the residency and citizenship process. As this could take 8-10 years, I’m at a loss.
It seems to be a choice between living in Europe now, but with instability and a more difficult or unlikely path to citizenship (for example through a Blue Card, looking for work, being kicked out if I lose the work after a year or two), and going through the GV process and putting off living in Europe for 8-10 years.
Have you found out anything new? Feel free to PM me.
Doesn’t the new Portuguese nationality law remove any requirement to have ties to the country? Only required to show valid residency permit. The draw of the PGV is that you don’t have to live in PT. If you get a visa to live and work anywhere else legally it should not be an issue?
False. Several lawyers have told me it’s illegal to hold the Portuguese GV and another temporary Schengen Zone residence visa. I am not sure I’ll do the Portuguese GV because it prevents me from living anywhere else in Europe (aside from Portugal) until I get my Portuguese citizenship - which isn’t even guaranteed, and could take 8-10 years.
That’s true. Many people choose Portugal over Spain golden visa, because Spain is 10 years, and Portugal is advertised as 5 years to citizenship. As we know now, the latter is completely untrue. So Spain has not such a bad offer.
Except for the bit where, if you actually want to naturalize, you need to actually live in Spain (>= 10 months a year, broadly) for the first 5 years to qualify for permanent residency, Then you have to renounce your existing citizenship in order to naturalize.
My understanding is that Greece is even worse - you basically have to become Greek, heart mind and soul, or something akin to it, if you expect to get a passport - whatever the rules are, it’s discretionary, and if you can’t walk the walk, forget it. So I’ve heard, anyway.
Portuguese GV requirements are some of the most laxed in Europe. You really need to be there for only 35 days in 5 years (though more is certainly better). You only need to acquire language skills at A2 level, which is nothing compare to Spanish B2. You can still use your temporary residency card to move freely throughout Europe. And for those who have means, check the Spanish tax system (like wealth tax on your world-wide assets) and compare it to the Portuguese (which has no real wealth tax and gives you huge exemptions for the first 10 years of residency). And if you would like, look into real estate purchase and/or lease rates in major Spanish centres - that would be quite sobering compare to Lisbon or Porto.
Then, Portugal is not looking all too bad after all, even with lengthy GV application process and aggravations during the renewals…