Thanks for info . Thank God in end everything went well . Party Time today 
3 Likes
So is the law saying that after my initial 2 years of my Golden Visa, I would have to re-apply for a D2 visa, and that D2 application is subject to approval? In other words, it This would mean that I would have to setup some sort of company? Iām confused about the wording here.
I get what the gov is trying to do which is trying to get us GV holders with a lot of capital to create some economic output for the Portuguese economy instead of holding onto property, which creates little value after the construction of said property.
As for the D2 visa, what type of company can we setup? I read that the only requirements for the D2 visa is to setup a company.
Hypothetically, can I setup a company that does short-term (Airbnb) rentals for my existing GV property, and use that newly established business to qualify for my D2 visa?
Iām seeing many loop holes with this scheme to transition GV holders to D2.
1 Like
Iām not convinced that Mercan still canāt find a path forward, since the proposed law still allows for investment visas that āpreserveā or ārehabilitateā cultural heritage. Depending on how the powers-that-be define ācultural heritageā sites, Mercan may be able to claim that that is already satisfied for most/all of their current projects. That would certainly be my play if I were in their shoes. Everything they have built includes rehabilitating something. And almost every building in Portgual would qualify as a cultural heritage site if it were in the US just from their age alone!
2 Likes
Cultural heritage is usually (granted, it is a low volume pathway) pre-approved donations to museums.
Seems a little farfetched that building hotels would countā¦in Portugal, they are just old buildings!
1 Like
Throwing my own view out here, having re-read the laws this morning. I think we need to go back to what Costa said on 30th March:
In relation to the visas already granted and their renewal, what we have decided, in order to give security to all those who hold them, is that, their residence permit, at the moment of renewal, and if they meet the criteria that are currently foreseen for their renewal, will be converted into a normal residence permit, just like any other foreigner residing in our country.
In relation to the processes that are pending examination, they will continue to be processed in accordance with the general law, which in the meantime is new and which foresees the granting of a residence permit for business investment purposes or for cultural or scientific research activities.
And, therefore, the processes that are pending today will be examined in accordance with the general law and with the certification by AICEP, or by Banco de Fomento, or by IAPMEI, or by the National Innovation Agency, or by the Ministry of Culture, of their economic, scientific, or cultural added value.
So, we end up with a general regime and everyone will be treated according to the general law and without jeopardizing legal security.ā
So if you re-read new Article 44 and 45 in that context, it seems more clear:
-
If you have a residence card already, youāre home free. No change to the status quo.
-
If your application is pending, thereās a problem here. Some government agency is going to have to decide that your investment is āentrepreneurialā. Unless thatās designed to be a fudge, that sounds like a high hurdle to clear.
As someone in the second group, Iām now quite pessimistic.
4 Likes
Hi everyone, I am elated to hear about the new developments and the proposed term of the government for not retroactively abolishing the 7 days requirement.
However, I am a little confused as to the conversion into D2 visa of the pending applications and the renewal of those who already obtained the Golden Visa mean. Does this mean that we have to set up a company in Portugal and produce a solid business plan that will be reviewed for its social, economic, and cultural impact?
3 Likes
I donāt think we should go back and analyze what was said orally several weeks ago. They have clearly made major changes since then.
I am no lawyer and havenāt had the time to go through everything with a magnifying glass yet, but I trust the lawyersā analysis, namely that with the current proposal every investor that gets their application in prior to the date the law enters into force will be okayāincluding renewals.
8 Likes
Noted - my point is that several of us have been looking at Article 45 and trying to understand whatās intended by this review by government agencies. Re-reading Costa made it clear to me that the draft is exactly in line with what he said then. In fact, nothing really has changed between his 30th March comments and this new draft, except clarity that the 7/14 day period continues to apply (which he did not make explicit).
2 Likes
There is certainly a very welcome shift in the governmentās tone away from rug-pulling.
However, I would sleep a lot easier if they spelled out the rules for exactly how someone who holds an ARI permit today based on real estate, would be grandfathered into a D-2 renewal.
āā¦the conversion of the residence permit into a residence permit for entrepreneurial immigrants under the terms of no.4 of article 89 of Law no. 23/2007, of 4th July, in its current wording,ā says the proposed law, but article 89 para 4 in its current wording is all about entrepreneurs creating companies in incubators, not an absolutely straightforward fit.
6 Likes
Article 44 para 4 (the proposed law) carefully retains the āgolden PRā, the ability for ARI investors to pay the ā¬7,000 or whatever and get a 5-year PR at the end of year 5, with minimal stay requirements, in contrast to the normal PR. Another welcome sign of a commitment to non-retroactivity.
6 Likes
Fair points, and it could very well be that your reading of the draft is correct as it currently stands. This is still a draft in the sense that itāll go through several more steps of polish in the parliamentary process.
But I think the directionality is quite clear, the government isnāt actually trying to screw current investors over. I donāt know if itās because they care about Portugalās reputation, constitutionality, or the threat of lawsuitsābut either way I believe that ironing out these kinks is what the rest of the process is there for.
After all, they have come a long way from their power point!
15 Likes
+1 for this. For the US EB5 , starting new US jobs is a requirement and Mercan manages to run effectively the same hotel/build program (officially money is equity and at risk, but they will buy it back and they are able to show X jobs per investor )
I would wager a beer they will manage this (with maybe a bump or two to be smoothened ) just fine.
2 Likes
Yes, this is confusing however it is not something which comes with the proposed law. The current regulation is also the same. When I received my first card about a month ago my lawyer advised me to spend 7 days during the first year of the card although the card is valid for two years. When I asked whether I can do 14 days within 2 years instead, they told me that although SEF started issuing the first card for two years during the pandemic, the legislation pertaining to the minimum stay requirements did not change so the law still reads ā7 days within the first yearā.
3 Likes
There is a lot to celebrate with this final draft - and I suspect more may still change to soften the governmentās position further as the bill is debated.
The major question, as others have alluded to is surrounding the change to the D2/entrepreneurial visa. I have gone ahead and created a separate discussion thread on this topic available here Golden Visa to D2 Visa.
6 Likes
I caution that this is a temporary victory at best. These issues will come up again in the future , maybe in 1 year maybe in 5 years. As you visit or live in Portugal be gratuitous to your host country. Show that GV , err D2 holders are good people. Donate, volunteer , support local merchants , etc. basically, donāt be a poster for the ungrateful foreigner . I am hopeful when this comes up next time we will have ready hundreds of example to counter the arguments against us.
8 Likes
All benefit of GV are retained and moved to D2 category. New name all remains the same or this " Special D2" will inherit some benefit of D2 as well i.e., D2 has 2 years for first card, then renewal card has 3 years. I doubt the government give that advantage to Special D2. They need to suck as much money as possible and best way to suck is by making the Special D2 renew as many times as possible! However, at least, once we are in, we are still safe until now!
2 Likes
GB is absolutely right. There is an image problem with people like us who have gotten or are applying to get Golden Visas in the country. Unfortunately the lawyers and others who are helping us have not done anything to combat that or tell us. I am not a money launderer, arms dealer, etc. We all need to change the impression by getting involved in Portugal and change impressions one heart and mind at a time.
3 Likes
Thomas,
While you are right this is a proposal, a thorough analysis of the law including analyzing all the referenced articles in the end leaves a number of things to be desired. A more detailed analysis is coming.
In my training, drafting anything legal should make the intended objective as clear and straightforward as possible. This does not. It makes all GV applications an exception to an existing law, primarily Article 89 No. 4 of the 23/2007 of 4 July Act - 11th version, without proposing to change any of article 89 to give us the legal framework to protect our rights and mount a defense in the future. To do so will mean calling on past history and laws that Article 43 of the proposed amendment to the 23/2007 of 4 July Act specifically revokes in great detail. Why is the revocation done so clearly, and in my opinion the creation done so sloppily.
To that end, we need to be proactive in educating based on the text and facts to enable people to then make this own decisions, but hopefully push for the changes we all want to see happen.
4 Likes
Not exactly: in the eyes of Lisbonās and Portoās city governments (as well as in many other locations), the āoldā buildings have high historic values. In both cities, building departments jealously guard against any alterations to the faƧades and even interior layouts of many old properties. There are also only few architectural firms who are certified to rehabilitate the properties in the historic city centres.
This is not something that existed in the past and unfortunately many unattractive āmodernā buildings were allowed to be erected alongside of the old ones. However, this approach is currently in-place.
4 Likes
And they wonder why itās so damn hard to build housing in portugal
1 Like