14-Day Requirements: Proofs

Nope.

take an index card, cut it to size, write the NIF on it, and laminate it. done.

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Great idea!

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Is anyone getting NIF for their under-18 kids and using them “daily” as well while in PT?

It’s also printed on the back of the TĂ­tulo de ResidĂȘncia card.

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I have some doubt that receipts with NIF are acceptable. Because, technically, anyone could use your NIF number while you are not in Portugal. So, in my opinion, it is not really a convincing proof. But, of course, having receipts with NIF is still better than nothing.

The only valid and 100% concrete proof is the certified paper from police. I am not sure that in the police station there exists this kind of paper. Basically, I would go to police to ask him a a paper stating that this person named ABC with this passport number XYZ physically presents in police station on day 
 Then I repeat this process for 13 days (except day 1 I have the stamp on passport). It sounds really stupid to me. But God knows what happens with SEF. They could do anything they want to us.

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My friend family got their first ARI residence permits in 2013 and had renewed 4 times so far. They bought apartment in Lisbon and obviously no hotel booking. The evidences of stay in PT for renewals were copies of boarding passes to PT and not-really-daily-receipts with NIF. So far no issue at all.

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I’d agree. you can think about this too much.

Consider the NYC tax regime. If you have a residence in the city 183 days in a calendar year, you pay city income tax at 4.2%. Needless to say, a ton of people stay in the city <182 days. Needless to say, the NYC tax authorities demand proof. People do this in a ton of ways:

  • ezpass logs (but how do they know you are in the car even if it is your car?)
  • selfies with newspapers (did you have them brought in to you at the office by one of your employees who lives in PA?)
  • go buy a coffee at the shop every morning (did someone else buy it for you?)
  • GPS loggers (but what if you have someone else haul your phone around? did you make up the data?)

Tales abound of billionaires having their drivers dash across the GW before midnight to make sure they get out in time.

You can find any number of ways to prove it, and any number of ways to cheat the system. In most cases most of the time, it’s just a matter of telling a coherent story, and having reasonable evidence to back it up. The less reasonable the story, the more evidence required.

My lawyer, who has been doing this a while, has indicated that it doesn’t take all that much - save some boarding passes and hotel receipts or whatever.

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I FINALLY found the official word on this from SEF. The same things we have already heard, but there is so much noise and false information it is hard to know what is truth.

According to renewal requirements:
This proof may be provided by presentation of boarding passes, proof of hotel accommodation, proof of purchase of goods/services in TN, among others.

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Correct, this is stated in the internal SEF ARI Manual, page 25:

“Esta prova pode ser realizada atravĂ©s da apresentação de cartĂ”es de embarque, comprovativo de alojamento em unidades hoteleiras, comprovativos de aquisição de bens/serviços em TN, entre outros.”

TN = National Territory

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Highly recommend scanning receipts and boarding passes etc. into a digital file because ink fades quite dramatically over short time. Save hard copies, yes, but scan them to make digital copy while the ink is still fresh.

Good luck!

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Does anyone know how the number of day is actually calculated? For instance if I arrive on the 3rd and depart on the 16th, is that 13 days or 14 days?

Assuming they don’t care about timestamps, you could include both the 3rd and the 16th, so long as you have some evidence of presence for those days (e.g. buy something giving your NIF).

Although per this thread 7 days during first year or 14 days during first two years? I’m still not sure if the requirements are:

years 1-2: 14 days
years 3-4: 14 days
years 5-6: 14 days

Or

year 1: 7 days
years 2-3: 14 days
years 45: 14 days

which are quite different requirements if you want to spend all 14 days in a row. E.g. according to the 2nd interpretation, 14 days in the first year would mean 7 are unnecessary and won’t count towards your years 2-3 requirement.

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This is a good question for your lawyer.

In the US, arrival and departure days counts as days in the country. See e.g.

Also be careful because the test for tax residency counting days might be different than for immigration purposes.

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Curious about how the residency for immigration counts (or not) towards tax residency? IE, if I’m in-country for the 14days, am I liable for PT taxes for those 14 days?

Does anyone know if SEF typically asks for proof of # days proactively?

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Ok so my question regarding proof of physical stay in PT is this. No problem to keep boarding passes in and out plus hotel stay receipts for each family member. But regarding proof of purchases with NIF everyday during our stay. If this is indeed a requirement then presumably it will be required for EACH family member and not only for the main applicant? As the main applicant I am the only family member with a Portuguese bank account and NIF. So it’s not a problem to provide these receipts and bank statements for myself. But do I now need to open a bank account for my spouse and adult children as well, get NIFs for each of us, and make sure everyone buys something everyday as proof that each of us were present in PT? Sounds totally daft. I suppose spouse and kids could just use their UK bank card to make purchases in PT and provide those UK bank statements. (I was planning to use my PT bank account and debit card solely for PT expenses). But they don’t have PT NIFs and I wanted to avoid anything that generates even more paperwork.

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Doesn’t Portugal not have an electronic record of entries and exits? Where I currently live it’s pretty easy to apply for your own (for a small fee).

@elle1 Your family do not need the bank accounts unless they really want them. Only the NIF should be obtained for everybody and that’s what I recommend.
Then as you go about your daily shopping, you can present a NIF of any one of the family members at the checkout, so all of you will have a receipt with a NIF printed.
Then I suggest you scan the receipts as the ink fades quickly.

There is a website called e-fatura, which gives you a barcode with your NIF, so it is becomes even easier to just scan it during the checkout instead of going “um, dois, tres,
” with the cashier :grin:
https://faturas.portaldasfinancas.gov.pt/

Now, in relation to the evidence for SEF, it is not “mandatory” per se to present a NIF receipt for each GV holder and family for the renewal. They may request it, and therefore it is prudent to collect NIF receipts during your stay. But it’s not like you must have one NIF receipt per day per person. What if you did no shopping at all on a particular day? You would have no NIF receipt. SEF cannot force you to buy unnecessary stuff :slight_smile:

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Thanks @tommigun Very helpful.

I think in the end I will just get them each their own bank accounts, bank cards and NIFs and get them to use their cards whenever they go to PT. I guess you just can’t be too cautious with this process. Better safe than sorry!

I’m also looking ahead to our future citizenship applications and the proof for each of us of having a ‘connection’ to Portugal. As we don’t live in PT, don’t have a home there and will likely only have met the minimum stay requirements, I guess it may be wise to get in the system now, and have each person build up their own individual track record of not only visiting but also having bank statements with a bit of a transaction history to show, no matter how small.

But if you have bank statements showing transactions why on earth do you still need the receipts with NIFs? Why wouldn’t the bank statements and transactions histories be enough? Also I believe it is potentially fraudulent to use someone else’s bank card, even with their agreement. So if SEF don’t accept bank statements with the obvious transactions history showing, then they are essentially accusing you of having committed some kind of fraud.

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What about taking photos of ourselves every day in front of some Portuguese street sign or shop front? The photos’ metadata would indicate the date and location the photos were taken!

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