Citizenship for kids and the spouse

Thanks for your kind words. I can also get your frustration. If you’ve talked to 10 lawyers certainly you’ve done due diligence. That said, I’d suggest that the likelihood of getting a better/clearer answer on a forum like this is not that high. :slight_smile:

I don’t imagine that it’s really all that hard to get the kids in one way or the other. I think kids on the GV just makes it so they can get citizenship at the same time in a clear fashion, and I would guess that doing so means they get in on the same terms as the parents, irrespective of the various other nuances of the law, and I bet even if they turn 18 half-way through. In talking to my lawyer, it’s clear that there’s the rules, and what actually happens. A lawyer can make arguments to SEF about this or that situation and get them to do X or Y if it makes sense. You just need the right lawyer. We’ve seen this just in the whole SEF appointment thing - some lawyers are better than others at making the system work.

That said, I’m going to go back to @susanayang statement from the other thread:

“I can’t stress enough that getting citizenship is not as easy/ simple as some of you think.”

We keep getting told that GV will get you citizenship. That’s how it’s sold by all these firms and funds and some lawyers. Well, no. If you look at the laws implementing ARI, it only uses the word “shall” for permanent residence. You’re just eligible to APPLY for citizenship, with GV waiving the residence requirement, and also freezing the qualifications for your citizenship to be those in effect as of the point in time of your issuance of visa. There’s no “shall” about it. My lawyer agrees with susana on this.

Now, it’s not that Portugal makes it so all-fired hard to get citizenship, I don’t think. There’s some referents I’ve seen where there’s legal opinions/etc that say all you need to do is prove the language requirement as a “tie”. I suspect, like Susan, it’s not that simple in practice. However, from what I have gathered (from other sources and my lawyer), it’s just not that hard to create “ties”, either. Travel there more than the minimum 1wk/yr. (OMG I have to spend another week a year in the Algarve sitting on a beach with some vinho verde! TORTURE!!! ) Get a B-level in Portuguese instead of an A-level. Join AFPOP, all of EUR100/yr. Join FB AFIP and comment on stuff. Take a class on Portuguese history - Portugal was the first world-spanning European empire, after all, could be enlighening. Keep up on the news. Show that you care about the place and that it’s not just some monetary transaction to get an EU passport that oh then you’re gonna go somewhere else anyway. I think that this kind of thing is the “facade” that Portugal puts up that keeps the EU from really cracking down on their GV - showing it’s not CBI by some other name. GV programs are about residence, not citizenship.

I think if you treat it like some transaction, it’ll end up biting you. If you don’t, then it’ll probably all be just fine one way or the other. Of course we want a world with certainties, but it often doesn’t work that way.

Obviously this is all just my opinion, others are free to disagree and that’s fine. Personally, I don’t care. My wife and I love the place like we love Costa Rica. Even if we were to decide to move elsewhere eventually, we have friends there and are going to end up with pretty reasonable ties one way or the other, so I’m just not that concerned. I also really, really like my lawyer, so I have confidence they’ll work it out one way or the other. But I know it’s not that simple for others.

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